AK-47 fire is ineffective?

Wow, Skypig!
I guess all us old guys weren't shot down then, since ineffectice fire certainly couldn't bring down a bird as reliable as a UH-34D or a CH-46. We must've had some high number of pilot error issues or mechanical problems, if that's the case! Gotta keep those memories of the metal eating southeast asian mosquitoes alive!
Sometimes the idiocy knows no boundry! "Of course" those .50's will work! When you need them, fire away! What do you mean he got the head space gap wrong??? LOL!
I feel your pain!
Have a good memorial day everyone!

Semper Fi
Joe

AK-47 fire is ineffective?

Ditto on that WOW!!!

I'll bet there are 300,000 or so Americans that will argue the effectiveness of the AK. Most Aircrews that were shot of the sky were probably under the impression that they were the victim of some eagle eye'd gomer perched in a tree with his trusty Bow & Arrow. He probably just had to lead us a little more.

Take some time this Memorial Day weekend to remember our fall brothers.

Semper Fi

Tom

Test Fire Area

We had the same song and dance during Desert Storm I, in 1991. I was a Huey Crewchief with HML-767. There was supposed to be an area to test fire our weapons, but, as the situation progressed, that area was, for the most part, non-existant, sometimes we had one other times we did not. Its a nice feeling when you pull the charging handle back twice only to discover your .50 cal is now a single shot sniper rifle with a 100 round magazine. It was easy taking apart a .50 cal in flight when I was a CH-53D Crewchief, its nothing short of a pain in the butt trying to accomplish the same feat in a Huey. You have to be careful not to lose anything over the side. What fun memories.

Garfield411
UH-1N and CH-53D
Crewchief

Be Ready, Be Sure

I as AC in my bird made very sure the guns fire every day. Even if no contact is made. I always wanted to know they worked and my doors had a handle on the systems.

Ineffective AK-47 fire

This thread was from some time ago, but I guarantee the rag-heads of today may not be very effective with their '47's, but the 'gooks in 'Nam, were very good shots with their's. I certainly agree with that. Think they were getting bad scoop. Semper Fi, Ready-App.

Ineffective AK-47 fire

I don't know if it was my attitude but I was sometimes puzzled by our altitude back in the day. Dale

Small Arms

HMM-262 lost 43 aircraft to "ineffective" small arms fire in Vietnam. 28 of those in a 90 day period from January 68 to April 1.

It may be time to update the offical USMC definition of "ineffective". Thank God they weren't slinging "effective" small arms fire at us!

Semper Fi

Hey Hip

Guess someone forgot to check with the Assassin when he was Deputy Commandant/Aviation before they put out their gouge. Fred took a hit from a guy standing below our Phrog in the Que Sons when he shot up through the plexiglass. He knows they can hit what they aim at!!!

You could have fooled me

I have a scar, about the size of a fifty cent peice on my lower right leg from ineffective small arms fire. It sure the hell effected me and the other members of the crew at the time.

hill shooters

Hey there Howdy, Maybe it was just those goomers in the hills up north at Quang Tri. I left at the end of May69 as you were getting there and I guess all the practice they had at me paid off.

Ineffective.,my arse

WOW !!! I check this site at least once daily & have no clue how I managed to miss this post. That being said..,please permit me these comments:
FAR be it from me..,to dispute observations as purveyed by our military leaders as to rated efficiency of certain enemy ground-fire with respect to
air born targets of opportunity.
However.,it occurs to my "olive-drab" mind.,that those responsible for drawing said conclusions.,must've been flying PAX on a battleship.,or.,(& this is just a thought) in hot pursuit of a rapidly retreating enemy force.,
that was employing the "spray & pray" technique.,over their shoulders.
Personally.,I found the AK-47 MOST effective...,THANK-YOU-VERY-MUCH!!!

FEMA graduates!!!!

It sad to see that FEMA graduates are getting established into the higher echelons of the Marine Corps. We are deep crap folks!:eek:
Just read an article about the big amphibious landing exercise out in California ( to impress the public and politicians about the Marine Corps), but that was after reading what the head man at the defense department said concerning the need for Marine Corps equipment. It seemed to hint that there was no need for a Marine Corps now that there is no more need for amphibious landings!!:mad: I'm sensing that there is going to be another attempt to do away with the Marine Corps as the U.S. of A. doesn't need a Marine Corps doing Army type battles. They have the big stuff that the Marine Corps doesn't have.:( This attitude of ineffective fire amongst the higher staff echelons can't do the Marine Corps any good. There is a great need to just let the Lt's and Captains control the training and fighting and if you'r setting in an airconditioned office thousands of miles, shut the hell up.. When your in the fight and dodging the bullets, then you can put your 2 cents in!!:)

Ineffective Ha

I was shot 3 times in my left calf and leg in 1968 in RVN. I was kindly allowed to finish my enlistment and leave the Corps in 1974. Then Commandant denied reenlistment because I walked with a limp. I left as a SSgt. One year later I was recruited into the Air Force Reserve to train as a C141 Loadmaster and then to Rigger's School. No problem for the Air Force, they needed all of the warm bodies they could get. Spent 2 years in the Reserve, got loadmaster certified, attended jump school and rigger's school..Trained along side Army and Marines. In 1977 I joined the Active duty Army after being told I could not rejoin the Corps. I was trained in Air Defense Artillery; then Infantry School-Whoopee. One year later I was sent to LaJolla Calif. Scripps Institute of Oceanography for computer training. From 1980 till 1988 I served in various overseas assignment's of which many were mostly independant duty. Retired at Fort Sill Oklahoma. Then worked for Secretary of Defense (HA) as a computer system engineer. I am so glad the AK47 was not effective. If I had not been wounded, I would not have received all of the great training I got.
Semper Fi

Lucky for me but I never did get hit by an AK-47 round. But I did patch up many of the holes that they caused in our choppers. First plane that patched up had 62 holes ( in's and out's) so I'd say that the AK-47 produced some effective damage in that respect.

inefective 47 fire

I had thought I had posted about the day we were on a Gun mission, and a 47 round came up through the ramp, and into the #2 engine compartment, blowing my main oil line almost into. It missed my Gunner on the ramp 60 less than a foot, as I still have the classified pictures of it, All the Pictures. The engine caught fire, and the power went down to nothing. Being heavy with 9 crew, and the Battallion CO, a Large Man, Col. Doty,(I believe we all had oversized 3/4 inch Chicken Plates on, I know mine was extra large), and belts and belts, and more belts of 50 cal for the 4- 50's we had as well, we went down like a rock. I've now come to the conclusion it was a lucky shot, as the gooks were engaged with our Grunts on the ground as well. We all lived, but each was injured pretty good. It was 14 days before me, and most the Crew could pass the Flight Physical again. Yes, I would say if it hit you in the right place, it was on the effective side. Semper Fi, and READY-APP.

Our S4 chief SSgt Douglas got hit in the wallet with a 47 round didn't pentrate the skin but letf a big knot ,they where had 3000 feet. SgtMaj Douglas was killed in Marine Barracks explosion in Biruite. SF

AK Fire

One day at MARTD South Weymouth, while passing time, I decided to count the bullet holes in one of our H-34s. I got up to 119 on one side and gave up. Does anyone else remember beer can patches? I couldn't judge the caliber of all the holes, but the most of them looked around AK 47 size. Good thing it's not effective.

Semper Fi

Buck

Ak

An H-34 from H&MS-36 got jumped by NVA in spider holes which resulted in a whole gaggle of holes. One round went between two jugs, through the deck and glanced off the co-pilot's cyclic making a perfect "V" in it. Another went through the crew chief's ICS box ending up inside it. The round was stretched out about twice the width of a pencil lead. The radio compartment was shredded. Too many hits on that plane to list. Co-pilot was the only one hit and it was minor.

Wayne

Ak

Good Lord Wayne. Those 34's as well as a number of others were very tough, like many of the Crews. Think 165 had a Bird come back with 167 plus holes in it. No crew were wounded. Time around mid '69. Could be wrong on that, just a small bit though. All have good ones. Semper Fi, and READY-APP.

Coke can repairs

I recall patching a hole in our '53 using a Coke can while we were down at the Special Forces base in Kontum Sept '70. You do what you have to do to get the birds back in the air. Blade tape also was an expedient repair method.

AK-47 alledged #1

The ak-47 is susposed to be rated the number 1 combat weapon produced to this point. So says the military channel. I would rather have the M-14 than a ak. The clip could be designed to hold 30 rounds as well, then see which one is better. The 47 is not very good being on target as often, but it was rated that anyway. The 14 is more accurate for certain, but they don't seem to count that. Semper Fi, and READY-APP.

M-14 Accurate

I totally agree. The M14 is and was an excellant rifle. The larger magazine would have been great. I really enjoyed it while on active duty. Could always count on expert at the range with my M14. SF

M-14 accurate

I agree spook. I could put the rounds where I wanted then most every time. I held back, as I was not about to have my MOS changed just because they needed people that could fire well. Marksman was just fine with me. I wanted Choppers, and thats what I got. I know Marines that had their Mos's changed because of firing expert. I've seen slow motion shots of the ak on auto, and you can see the barrel bending most every shot. Semper Fi, and READY-APP.

Actually...

...I liked that twang and plastic sound of the M16 when it fired.

It made me feel like I was firing a toy again.