1977 Crashs of IAF

During the year 1977 we have had during one year period more then 4 crashes- one was at May 10, 1977 (54 Dead) second a week later with 3 dead and November same year a crash that kill 2 pilots and 2 crew Mechanics
Now the information is mostly leading to BIM and Rotor Blades problems
can anyone help with information- you may got a report- a story or anything- remember about 2 years or later same model craft crashed during the Iran rescue attempt- also we read that a BIM issue was involve there- Other then the C 130 incident, but earlier

Do not know if this applies, but on a presidential support flight from Chicago back to Quantico, circa '73, turbulent wx over W.Va., heavy, in and out of blade stall, found five blade bolt heads popped/gone on postflight. Flew that flight with, I think, Ford. Lanny

KD Logue

We have, on-board, a Marine that, I believe is the best source for info on anything CH-53 and the Iranian incident...K.D. Logue, 1st/Sgt., ret'd. He was there and can shed light on this, when/if he checks in.

BIM incident Reserves Alameda

Dont know of accidents based on the BIM system . The accident back in that period on a CH53A returning from Reno was the result of the Crew Chief thinking that the BIM indicating loss of pressure was a faulty BIM. He than proceeded to certify the Helicopter ready for flight. It crashed along the highway back towards Alameda losing all aboard. The blade had failed due to the cracked spar which was the loss of pressure as indicated by the BIM. The crash in the desert on the Iran Rescue attempt was apparently not related to the BIM system. As I understood it was ecessive dust, sand resulting loss of visual contact & resulted in a collision between the Helicopter & the C130. 1st Sgt K. D. Logue was there & he is on this site & may respond. Several CH53D crashes while I was at MAG-36 for 14 years , 1973-1987, none was a result of BIM problems. Some pilots error, running out of fuel in one (near Okinawa), lack of left pedal authority in another (Mindoro P.I.) , loss of MGB oil in another returning from Japan , couple flew into mountain during IFR conditions "Team Spirit Exercises" in Korea . Lost many good Marines during those incidents!! SF PM

Then there was a 53 midair out of Santa Anna when an Army trained PUI did not understand the Army vs Naval way of changing lead--new lead flys forward vice old lead flys to the wing position.

Joe Reed;19906 wrote: We have, on-board, a Marine that, I believe is the best source for info on anything CH-53 and the Iranian incident...K.D. Logue, 1st/Sgt., ret'd. He was there and can shed light on this, when/if he checks in.

Do yu know how can I get K.D. Logue, 1st/Sgt. on line?

K.D. Logue

I hope he (K.D. Logue) maybe have or know some information regarding the crashes of 1977- IAF (Israeli Air-force) as I understand now he serve at the same period of time- red some information and its look as he is No 1 expert on Ch 53... I think and speculate the IAF and US or Sikorsky had to talk about these issues, share information especially since the IAF had plenty of experience operating in desert conditions and sand storms at that period- 1967 and 1973 wars at Sinai desert- Jordan valley and other such locations- if he can contact us or get on line it will be great- such many crashes at one year should have got someone attantion... but how we can find him? any suggestions? any contact with Sikorsky old staff?

Back in New River there was an incident of black BIM in HMH 362 back in the early to mid seventies. After a flight, which apparently also had a black BIM indicator onb post flight, Joh Bohr accepted the bird after maintenance serviced the blade and found no loss of pressurre. After his flight, the BIM was again bad, and was again serviced. The next flight lost a blade up near VA and one of the passengers was the HMH 362's son, if I remember correctly. I remember thios as I flew the burial detail up to the site, and only the honor guard was allowed to go to the service. No pilots, crew, or the USMC band.

Hooper

I'd really be interested in one of the crashes in which a flight of two 53's crashed into the mountain where the Snowbird vor was over in west NC. This was in the mid '76 or very close. Lead pilot and c/p were killed, trail pilots both seriously injured.

Can provide three of the four names (pilots) if somkeone knows about this.

Hooper

Tom, that crash of two 53's in western North Carolina was in the fall of '76. It was another case of trying to stay VFR in IFR conditions. When the wingman say what was happening to lead, he was able to turn the aircraft so that the cockpit didn't hit head on but sideways. That's what saved them, and the crew was seriously injured, although they all survived. I had been the squadron CO a few months prior to that and was MAG-26 S-3 at the time of the accident.

Re: CH-53 A/C losses & Deaths

thomas.zuppke;20445 wrote: I'd really be interested in one of the crashes in which a flight of two 53's crashed into the mountain where the Snowbird vor was over in west NC. This was in the mid '76 or very close. Lead pilot and c/p were killed, trail pilots both seriously injured.

Can provide three of the four names (pilots) if somkeone knows about this.

Hooper

Hooper
Can you give me the names of the pilots involved and the ones that died. Assume it was the crash on 26 July 1976, BuNo 153313 CH-53A HMH-361
Thabnks
Al Barbour
history@popasmoke.com

Re: CH-53 A/C losses & Deaths

Not only KD Logue, but Chuck Lightle was also on the Carter Disaster in the Desert mission. I think
that either Chuck or KD was the Senior Marine on the mission.

Some years ago, KD gave me the straight scoop on the mission along with a good book on the subject.

The most glaring error I saw in the mission was in the planning, and the Navy's decision to remove
the EAPS on the aircraft and then to fly in to a sandstorm. This did not directly cause the crash, but
certainly was a detriment to the success of the mission.

As stated previously, the crash was the result of poor visibility in the dust cloud caused by running
engines and rotors.

Re: CH-53 A/C losses & Deaths

Mike, from my recollection when KD told us the story, he was SNCOIC of the mission. It is an amazing story!